What you Need to know - When Buying A PI Car.

[Guest fruitcakepablohoney]

taken from another forum.

There is little known detailed information on the PI business.

Recently have done some homework and will share with all of you the objective facts.

Of course some chaps wont like this post, but it's all about transparency and sharing what I have found in the process of due diligence while considering selecting the next purchase.

As long as you know the truthful facts and what they imply - then the potential buyer can make his/her own informed decision on the purchase you are free to spend you hard earned money on PI or AD car as you so wish.

PI cars come with factory warranty?

- Yes they come with factory warranty provided both the following conditions are met:

(1) the PDI (predelivery inspection) is done by an authorised dealer

(2) the service schedule is diligently adhered to and the service booklet stamped by an Authorized service center.

- With regards to PDI, some official brands in SGP refuse to PDI the cars at all for the PIs. Hence you will see high end PI sports cars (some 911s!) getting the PDI stamp in funny places like perhaps india! strange but true.

- Why is the PDI important: this make sure that during the transit and delivery from the factory, the car arrives at the customer in a standard that is fit for purchase by the customer. this does not mean just a wash and polish and stripping off the paint protector plastic. For complex german cars the factory will disable most things in the car and place the car in a "transport mode" - to exit this mode you will need a factory diagnostic tool to enable this change.....you dont simply drive on-and-off the car on a Ro-ro transporter ship....its much more complex than this!

PDI is not clear, now i need the service stamps

- Even if the PDI is cleared by an authorized dealer now you must collect the service stamps. Most PIs tell you that they have tie ups and you can service you car at ABC & XYZ workshop and get the service book stamped. Obviously none of these are authorized service centers....therefore the stamp is not valid in any sense when presented to the factory for claims.

I learnt from the representatives of the brands that this is a must because only the authorized service center is equipped with the tools and knowhow and prior training to work on the vehicle. There are specialized diagnostic computers and software. there are specific 'guided fault finding' protocols, specific repair instructions and manuals. Germans are tight ass engineers - every screw has a torque rating assiged to it and the factory will provide all this info and knowhow to the authorized agent.

If the car was cared for by the proper people, then the factory will be in a position to honor the warranty.

Was offered all manner of things including up to 5 years warranty from some chap. When I asked if their appointed service center had the knowhow and the proper computers for the diagnostics + electronic repair manuals - the silence was golden!

So now you have the proper PDI & service and your gearbox breaks

Yes you can claim....but you have to fork out the amount upfront first usually.

Here's how it works with an Authorized dealer car:

- you blow up the 30 grand double clutch gearbox

- car under warranty and properly serviced.

- in general, AD will change you gearbox and deal with the factory, the bulk of the claim is transparent to you. even if the factory says no full claim refund the AD will shut up and wont ask you to pay for the difference would they?

Here's how it works with the PI car:

- blow up the gearbox

- parts will be sourced from the AD cos the PI will ultimately go to them for all these big issues.

- you pay upfront say $30k cash and wait for the gearbox

- then your damage gets assesed, and let say the factory says they will only pay you back $20k. you are 10K out of pocket immediately.

- some of the PIs might offer to top up this difference, some not at all, some avoid this topic of conversation

- the process is much more difficult and not transparent to you et cetera.

a good example is the M3 from a PI. at least PLM still touch it.

try bringing a PI 911 to stuggart and you will get a even stiffer answer.

Is my PI car brand new?

Yes - according to the PI.

NO. according to the factory and here is why exactly:

The PI will take the car from another country, in the bulk of the cases the car will have to be registered in that country of origin - *this is when the factory warranty starts*. Then the PI imports it and it sits in the showroom locally for say 6 mths. you lose 6 mths from the date registered with the factory.

Of course some of the PIs give great service and will still somehow find a way to honor the promised warranty for a given period. this may be performed outside the knowledge of the factory and at the PIs expense.

*PI will always tell you that the car is brand new and never registered.

Well i have done some detective work and can prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that (almost all) cars are indeed registered in another country before importing to SGP and there is a paper trail to prove it.

*please note that this discussion will not entail a car known as a used import. dont even bother with these. when you find out that your OMV is rock bottom low on these classes of PI cars you wont buy them*

The only time the car is indeed really not registered is when the PI group themselves are the official Dealer of that particular car in the foreign country.

PI cars may not be specific for SGP Tropical Climate.

Most of your german autobahn stormers are sourced from europe.

they are very likely not topicalized for this region.

there are subtle differences for the cars in terms of cooling like additional radiators etc. also there are different states of tuning also for the high performance cars for a hotter climate. when we go into diesel in the future the tuning too will be different for European Diesel vs Diesel meant for countries that have higher sulphur contents et cetera.

Let say you have a non tropicalised "bi-turbo tricked out GT bahn stormer cruise missile". Of course if the dammed thing then has an overheating problem here being imported from Europe - the AD sure as hell aint gonna help you. you can see how much trouble this might escalate into.

just ask an owner of a certain xxx DTM that is PI. its a 1millon dollar paperweight!:wacky

PI cars have lower resale

just ask any PI porsche owner or BMW owner what the market sentiment is like for their cars

there are more things that i can ramble on about but I will stop here:

In Summary

when you distill every debated point down one singularity, you have only one issue to deal with when considering buying a car: - it is not about the outright purchase price. you must see it as a TCO event (Total Cost of Ownership). What is your Total Cost of Ownership?

What can the AD do for you? good will? longtime customer? etc etc

What can the PI offer you in terms of written assurance for the automobile which is probably 2nd most expensive purchase in your life after a house.

if you are clear and know, then by all means you are free to spend you hard earned dosh at either for various reasons of your own.

[g8crasher]

This piece is from VAGSG written by decksurgeon. Came across it when I was looking up for information on the Golf.

[Guest Sareve]

Man these new xxx DTM paperweights sound nice

[Guest ian511]

Good Good info that i believe most buyers are unaware / never thought thru before. Cheers!

[Guest Archer]

this makes a really good read...thanks for the info!

:thumbsup:

[Guest angela]

thank for the info jeff. might wanna make it a sticky...

[Guest fruitcakepablohoney]

Yup! You back yet?

[Guest Luci Ride]

fruitcakepablohoney wrote:

Here's how it works with an Authorized dealer car:

- you blow up the 30 grand double clutch gearbox

- car under warranty and properly serviced.

- in general, AD will change you gearbox and deal with the factory, the bulk of the claim is transparent to you. even if the factory says no full claim refund the AD will shut up and wont ask you to pay for the difference would they?

Here's how it works with the PI car:

- blow up the gearbox

- parts will be sourced from the AD cos the PI will ultimately go to them for all these big issues.

- you pay upfront say $30k cash and wait for the gearbox

- then your damage gets assesed, and let say the factory says they will only pay you back $20k. you are 10K out of pocket immediately.

Exhaustive read but informative & believe above talking about Golf GTi Mk 5? As per:-

g8crasher wrote:

This piece is from VAGSG written by decksurgeon. Came across it when I was looking up for information on the Golf.

Resale value for PI Golf & AD Golf Gti are approx the same with little difference, am using Golf Gti Mk 5 as benchmark since thread arise out of VAG Forum when discussing VW by g8crasher.

DSG Gearbox whole cost US$4000 airfreighted straight fm castle (Audi/VW mega warehouse) into Sin landed nett price. I know the charges as i blew mine back in 07' & bought 1 brand new.

Yes, buying AD the better choice but if PI price is min 15-20% Cheaper than AD & comes higher specs then AD then hell yes, PI i will go! Am on my 4th PI car & all are fairly pricy with Huge discounts & very high specs, didn't suffered huge losses as Advertised.

Make sure one does their homework & these are the few points that i've always work upon with all my PI cars:-

(1) Written contract stating min OMV & if falls below certain figures, 'rebates' on car price accordingly must be reimburse upon registration.

(2) Written contract stating exact month of delivery or else full refund.

(3) Written contract stating car being imported NEW status & NOT NEW USED Status

(4) Written contract stating full lists of specs as promised.

(5) Written contract that there'll be NO COE Top Up base on agreed purchase amount, below 'agreed' COE bid, PI will refund diff but above pre-agreed amount, PI will bear cost.

If one does their homework & deal is like the above, then even if gearbox breaks or engine goes, how much will you be staring at when the savings you had fm the purchase will offset your blown gearbox & engine :becky:

Case study, bought my Mk 5 Golf GTi back in 06' at S$110k fm PI which AD selling at S$135k, PI comes with S$10+k added specs like Factory fitted reverse camera/ 18' Rims/tires combo & sports suspension. In total I've 'saved' S$35k approx including specs & needn't have to wait 3 months.

Modded car & gearbox / engine blown, replaced factory supplied gearbox US$4k & engine US$7k which back in 07' or early 08' currency exchange rates was approx 1.6 which total up to approx S$15.5k! That is due to my itchy behind for modding it & i still saved S$20K!

Compare to my mum's Golf, we bought 2 together, hers still running fine without any problems & ppl offering her nearly S$66k for her may 06' golf & it's PI -pls refer to the ads & you'll see there's NO Diff with AD car.

If one doesn't like to do homework & source for their own parts then hell yes, stick to AD, however if you're the type who wants the BEST deals, highest specs available & know how/where to source for parts, plus how to negotiate then PI is the way to go!

[peterseow]

PI cars are perfectly fine, I personally brought down my 911,

Had a minor accident, Japan specs, rhd.

I would prefer to import it myself., than have a dealer to do it.

Many of the dealers go broke so its not wise to waste extra money

On the dealer, just that you cannot take loan. If you choose

To bring it yourself, yes it a lot cheaper

[lewisgoh]

Great article.

Thanks

[bags4queen]

Great information! Thanks

[gonegolf]

Any recommendations on which PI is reliable?  Thanks

[Sinnedmal]

I do agree with getting PI there are some risk.

 

Just like my Honda Stream group where when we compared the specs of the vehicle quite a vast difference.

 

Like PI use the gauges are different from AD; Rear brakes are drum instead , fuel tank topping up area a lot of different made.

 

All tricks to save money so they can get the best trade off to sale a cheaper car. There maybe many more difference which we can never know.

 

Unless the car model you want is not available by AD.

 

One important point of the parts may also not easily available in SG as well.

 

Just a thought .

[mmi]

Any recommendations on which PI is reliable? Thanks

Avoid SG vehicles @ bukit merah. Mediocre workshop. You Definitely do not want to put a 200k car in their hands.

[sillbeers15]

The article is biased.

 

Firstly, I make it clear that I am not in the car business and do not have any interest as PIs nor Agents.

 

I own both PI purchased and C&C+other agent purchased cars.

 

I use my cars for long periods from new,...my W124 was purchased by my dad new from C&C in 1988 and it still runs well today.

 

Gererally speaking Mercedes are well built. I have never encountered continuous problems or big ticket repairs including my SL (R230).

 

You choose to buy a car from PI either it is not available (or higher specs on same model) from the local agents or you are after the savings of ($10k to $30k) or both.

 

Ask yourself, if your car is purchased from agent and you encountered horandious repair headaches with the car, would you still have confidence to keep the same car for long?

 

Now if the same happens to your PI car, bite the bullet and get it sold off after repairing it! 

 

To my logic, there is no big disadvantages in buying from PI and not sure win buying from Agent either!

 

Btw I am waiting for my wife's new E200 to be delivered from C&C.

[Danguard]

I think the assurance and convenience with AD purchase is definitely what you pay a premium for. When car is defective for any reason you can be assured of full repairs and warranty for such repairs that you can fully rely on. Not all PIs can offer that same level.

And if PI car is intended to be sold if encountered substantial problems, as with all continental cars when selling off the dealer takes a big cut off as their potential margin I reckon

[mmi]

Another complaint for SG Vehicles

 

http://www.complaintsboard.com/complaints/sg-vehicles-continental-pte-ltd-unfair-practices-misleading-claims-by-sg-vehicles-c821867.html